Interviewer:
Can you tell us something about becoming such an incredibly in demand session organist after having just picked up the instrument. Were you called to do a lot of sort of let's get that Bob Dylan organ sound type of thing?
Kooper:
Well, I tried not to -- uh, when I'd get called for sessions after the success of "Like A Rolling Stone," I tried not to betray the Bob Dylan sound per se. You know, I mean you couldn't buy that for a nickel. So, I had other problems too, is I would, uh, if there was a session I didn't want to play, I didn't think, I wasn't bright enough to say, well, I'm booked then. Well, no, actually I was, and then they would say, well, can we do it then, so, and they'd keep going until they'd get me. So on the sessions that I really didn't want to do, I said, you know, I charge triple scale, which was unheard of at that time. And they'd go, okay, no problem. And I'd go, oh God. And then I'd really be embarrassed. So I got into some unbelievable messes. I remember, uh, one session, that was the Simon Sisters. It was Carly Simon and her sister Lucy being managed by Albert Grossman, Dylan's manager. And the, uh, the producer, the arranger on this date was Gary McPharland, this big jazz arranger. And I, I walked in with a polka dot shirt on and my long hair and some earring in my left ear, this is 1966. And uh, and there's like half of Count Basie's band in there. And I go, and you know, I recognize them because I'm a jazz fan. And I went, oh my God, what am I going to do now? And I walked over to the organ, and like the part was like, I couldn't read it, it was so complicated. So I went, I'm sunk. This is it. This is, this is it. So I went over to Gary McPharland and said, hi, Al Kooper. And he went, oh, nice to meet you. Heard a lot about you. And I went, bet you didn't hear this. And I said, listen, I'm a real big fan of your's and just about everybody in this room. And uh, uh, I can't play this part that's on the organ at all. I mean I can't read it at all. He says, well, here's what you do. He says, fold it, until it's closed and put it on the bench, the organ bench and then sit down on top of it and play whatever you want, because that's why they hired you anyway. I said, God bless you. And I went back and I listened to the song a few times and I started playing, and I got through the session, and I just said to myself, I can do anything. If I can play in a room with Count Basie's band, me, playing the stupid organ that I played at that time, then I can do anything. I can get through any session. And uh, the only calamity I ever had, and it was a bad one, was, uh, my friend Bill Sczymzyk was producing B.B. King. And he called me two months before the session to book me for it. And I said, yes, I'm in, I'm so excited. I'm going to count the days. And I did, I was so excited to play with B.B. And I got to the session and it was, uh, uh, Herb Lavelle was playing drums and uh, I really can't remember who else was on the session. And uh, it was very disorganized, much like a Dylan session. Because B.B. is a very nice guy but he's not like a take charge leader guy. And neither is Sczymzyk. And so there we all were looking at each other. And at times like that I would jump into the breech and you know try and bark some orders around and make it work if I could. And uh, so I said to, uh, Herbie Lavelle, uh, why don't you play like a fatback thing? You know, and he looked at me, like, that was the worst thing I could ever do in my life, was address him like that and tell him what to do. And he looked at me and said, "Fatback," like that. And I went, oh, jeez, and I like, and like the whole vibe was like, for me, was like blown. And I started to get this incredible migraine headache. And uh, there was just this really bad tension between Herbie Lavelle and me. And by the end of the night, I think we cut one song, by the end of the night I went over to Sczymzyk and I said, I think you should get a sub for me tomorrow night, because like Herbie, Herbie hates my guts, or get a sub for him, one or the other. He says, well, you know, B.B. really wanted Herbie to play. I said, okay, then you know, got with plan A like I said. Get somebody for me, because this ain't gonna work, it's gonna blow your whole thing and you know it's my fault too. So, the next night, they cut "The Thrill Is Gone." And I missed being on that, and I was really looking forward to that. So I think that was the worst tragedy of my session career. There were many, many high points and wonderful times, and challenging things and it's still ongoing today. But those are the two I remember.
Interviewer:
Can you tell us a little bit about Bloomfield? You worked with him a lot subsequent to the encounter on the Dylan session. Maybe you could say something about what it was in his playing that got that immediate sense of recognition out of you when you first heard with the guitar at the Dylan session.
Kooper:
Mike Bloomfield was an amazing person. He was a master musician and he was a great guy. The, the reason his reputation preceded him all the time was because at a time when all of us played like boys, he played like a man. He brought a maturity to his playing that was far beyond his years. He could go up and play with B.B. and it was like two men playing. He had assimilated all those things that take the rest of us years to assimilate. And he immediately played like a man. And, and that's what set him apart from the other guitar players of that time that were boys. They all played like boys. Even Clapton played like a boy for a while until he played like a man. Whereas Bloomfield immediately played like a man. And that's what he was aspiring to. Now Hendrix played like a boy, but he played like a wild boy. So it was okay. Uh, our careers were very parallel. We met at the "Like A Rolling Stone" session and so we both played with Bob on that. Then we both joined blues bands, he in the Butterfield Band, me in the Blues Project. Then we both left our blues bands to start horn bands, he with the Electric Flag, me with Blood, Sweat and Tears. Then we both got kicked out of our horns bands that we started -- and, and I got a job as a producer at CBS. And I said, well, enough time has passed, we are destined to come together and make a record together. And so we did the "Super Session" record together because I just saw our paths running parallel, and I thought we just had to come together and do that. And uh, we remained friends forever and ever, and just, uh, he was a wonderful guy. He was very, very funny. And I loved being with him. He was fearless. He wasn't afraid to say anything to anybody at anytime. He did some amazing things along those lines, and uh, I miss him a lot.